OMIDPOU = Outside Merced Irrigation District Place of Use

This 1978 MID Map of Areas of Domestic Water Use depicts the residential subdivision and golf course.  The subject matter of this posting concerns properties located within the small white square between the words “Barrett Cove” and the section number “27”.  The small triangle to the left (west) of the white square (below the number “27”) is the location of the former Deerwood Corporation Sales Office.  (Corner of Ranchito Drive and Merced Falls Road)  The red line identifies the Tuolumne-Mariposa County line.

WATER LICENSE 11395: August 1983: Domestic use at home sites within the service area of Sierra Highlands Water Company and a 55 acre golf course.  (Above map indicates golf course is actually 155 acres)

PHOTOS: Portions of Kassabaum Estates discussed in the last blog posting.  The former Deerwood Corporation sales office is in the background to the right of the white storage buildings.



Tom Porter: The other one I want service there and, in other words it’s in, within the district, and ah I want to know if you’re not willing to serve it what, what is the basis of your reason for rejecting

Inaudible-multiple voices

Director Skoien: What’s entailed there with getting water?

IGM Tynan: It’s outside place of use

Background talking

Tom Porter: In other words, there is a property to the east of us getting water and they’re bringing their line through our property and they’re also hooking up to a service to, to a meter that is on the corner of a lot we were going to build on – across the street on Merced Falls Road

Director Skoien: OK, wait, wait a minute I’m I’m I’m getting a

Tom Porter: confused

Director Skoien: Yeah, and not afraid to admit it (laughs) OK, let’s go by these numbers, 44, 45 and 46 OK?

Tom Porter: OK

Director Skoien: 46 is getting water?

Tom Porter: no, they’re not getting ah, ah, they’re not getting water from this district no.

Director Skoien: Oh, OK, where, whose using your other lot’s meter and getting water? One of those three?

Tom Porter: I’ll show (inaudible) point it out to all of you it that’s permissible

Multiple voices

Tom Porter: OK, this 40 acres right here

President Kinsella: OK

Director Skoien: I can’t see it

Tom Porter: is being served right here

Director Ross: (inaudible)

Tom Porter: there is a lot across the street, across Merced Falls Road

Director Skoien: You mean this one here?

Tom Porter: Yes

Director Skoien: OK

Tom Porter: And what they do is, they took, they hooked to the meter and they went through a drainage pipe that is underneath ah, Merced Falls Road, they came up here and they go, they traverse ah the west line of these properties and they get up to here and they have dug a trench in here and brought the pipe up here up in here and he’s right there’s a leak (inaudible) but they, leaks along here

President Kinsella: So it runs through your property then?

Tom Porter: They did without our permission and also they have a road in there without our permission

Director Skoien: OK now right in here, where is your, this is your Deerwood Offices right here?

Tom Porter: Yes

Director Skoien: OK, I’m just trying to get oriented

President Kinsella: Trying to get oriented

Director Skoien: Yeah, yeah, so these lots, this lot is behind your office and then this is further I guess south down Merced a little ways and then this forty acres behind is not yours

Tom Porter: No

Director Skoien: and the meter is on, what meter is he tied into?

Tom Porter: Ah, it’s, what lot is that Randy?

Unknown: If I had a map I could show you

Tom Porter: It’s 180 or something like that?

Unknown: It’s 580

Multiple voices-inaudible

Tom Porter: 580, 580 I’m sorry.

Betsie Ross: Did those two maps stick together? (inaudible)

Director Skoien: OK, so what is entailed in in putting lines there, it’s not as easy as Torre or what?

IGM Tynan: No because the thing is, again, going by the map in the office it’s showing ah these properties being inside the district boundaries but outside place of use

Tom Porter: Doesn’t make sense

President Kinsella: But he’s been paying availability?

IGM Tynan: No

Tom Porter: No

VP Richardson: No, not on these

Multiple statements of “no”.

Director Skoien: Now are you saying, that you’d be willing, are you going to pay back availability or that’s not

Tom Porter: Hey we’re here ah shooting the dice here right now

Director Skoien: (laughing) no I just, I

Tom Porter: In other words, in other words I’m here to say that I’d like to have service here, if you, if you say OK you owe us availability since we bought the property I’d be willing to do that. Ah, to keep the record straight.

[LEW’S VIEW:  I’m sorry, but if any availability fees are to be paid for ANY PROPERTY, shouldn’t they go all the way back to when all other property owners were required to pay and financially support this district?]

VP Richardson: But we still have the issue of outside MIDPOU

President Kinsella: Yeah

Tom Porter: Well it’s within your district.

VP Richardson: Well they’re two different animals.

Director Ross: Bill

President Kinsella: The license is what we, one of the things that we’re concerned about

VP Richardson: Because any water supplied to those properties would have to come out of the Ranchito well and as that board right there behind you says the Ranchito well is not producing enough.

Tom Porter: Well what, ah, why would with over 5,000 acre feet of water in McClure and you’re using only what 1,500 feet of that?

Director Skoien: If that

President Kinsella: If that

Tom Porter: Why do you need a well?

VP Richardson: That’s what the State Water Board says because of our outside

Director Skoien: That’s been my opinion all along but evidently it’s a law

Tom Porter: It’s a law that you can’t serve within your district?

President Kinsella: No

Director Skoien: No it’s kick, it’s a sleeping dog that’s been kicked, let me just say that.



Tom Porter: You know, I’d like to tell you a little story, I’m a good story teller. Brook Trails where we have a 160 lots, sold 2,500 up there, just lost another 280,000 on this kind of a thing, they’ve lost the, in 2011 they lost 600,000 in ’94 they lost a million two. In other words they filed suits, if this, if you’re supposed to be serving water within your district then we’ll test it, it’s not a threat, I’ll just get my attorneys we’ll work on it, and see whether you guys should be ah, I can understand if somebody is outside of your district and it’s the sphere of influence, you should say no, I agree with that. But here you’ve got somebody past me taking water and ah, with a real, make shift deal of, yes Dan?

IGM Tynan: I was just thinking of, I think it would be clearer if we got you gave you a copy of the contract with MID, because that’s our problem it’s almost, MID has our hands tied because our contract is with them, they have us inside place of use, outside place of use, but if I gave you a copy of the contract maybe you can read it over

Tom Porter: Oh I’d love to have a copy so that I could then present that to my attorneys and we go from there.

VP Richardson: Yeah, because it all has to go before the State Water Board

Tom Porter: well

VP Richardson: and MID doesn’t want to go to the State Water Board to expand the license where we can serve, we can only serve

Tom Porter: (inaudible)

VP Richardson: domestic home sites.

Tom Porter: I’m sorry Lew, they gave you the right to serve within this district

VP Richardson: No they did not

Director Afanasiev: They didn’t

Tom Porter: They did

VP Richardson: No they did not

Director Afanasiev: No

Tom Porter: Well, then let, can I ask, may I ask a question?

VP Richardson: Sure

Tom Porter: If somebody over here is not using water on a lot but they’re within the district, do you have to serve them or not?

VP Richardson: Yes. My Mom, my mother has been paying standby availability for 20 years and she hasn’t used one drop of water.

Tom Porter: So, ahh, but, so, the thing that really stops this in your opinion is availability fees, is that right?

VP Richardson: No, I, I

Director Afanasiev: No it’s MID

VP Richardson: The water license 11395 says we can serve water to the subdivision and to the golf course period. That’s it.

Tom Porter: Well how are you doing this other 40 acres there?

VP Richardson: Well just like a number of other properties that got under the radar in the past, when the license wasn’t acknowledged and LAFCo wasn’t aware of it, they rubber stamped things, we have to deal with them, and MID snapped us in the early 90’s and we had to go to the Ranchito well because we cannot serve Lake McClure water to outside MIDPOU properties, so the Ranchito well must produce that water.

Director Ross: I have a question Bill. I, I emailed Elizabeth and I asked her about this, you look at her ah report of a 12-13-11 she says, therefore we advise against committing any Ranchito well water to new users. So (cough), excuse me, I asked her, ah what does that, could you please clarify what that means? You know, new users, right? Ahum, she says, the study covered the engineering aspects not administrative or legal of the Ranchito well which includes the well productivity versus water usage outside the MID Place of Use. The ah usage data we were provided was a list of 34 to 36 customers who are outside MID Place of Use and goes back to a decade. Syndie provided the ah, the sphere sheets and I do not know whether the ah sphere sheets include everyone with a physical connection outside the MID Place of Use. The quest….I’ll stop right there, my question to her is, your example, you’re within the district boundaries,

Tom Porter: yes

Director Ross: you may or may not have been paying availability there maybe people that are but if you’re within, why can’t we serve these people because we’ve committed you know, the, ah, it’s within the boundaries. Anyway she says we don’t have any information in this office on parcels outside the place of use who have or have not been paying availability charges or any other fees, it is difficult for us to make a recommendation on drilling a new well since we do not know the extent of the situation. So I said to her well then let’s just put a new well in there. She said I don’t know. Ah, it is a very good question and brings up good legal, financial and administrative questions we are willing to help with this if possible and if needed. I mean, if somebody, you have this boundary ah and Schartz, he was when here he was outside, he’s a different issue, but here’s this thing that’s within the boundary the district should have a policy, because we set policies, that should say that we serve people who are not – that are within in boundary, you know, we set policy. Or we have a policy that says we don’t serve people within our boundary, but to me, we, we, we’ve now raised, ah created a monster by doing a well report and it says (pounds board table) we can’t serve anybody else so now it’s time to (pounds table) drill a new well because you’ve got people like Mr. Porter who has these lots within the district boundaries that want water, he’s not outside the boundary like Schartz was or you’re just gonna say we don’t serve everybody, I don’t know but everybody within the boundary (pounds table) we should be serving. Correct?

[LEW’S VIEW/QUESTIONS:  Created a monster by determining what the sustainable yield of the Ranchito Well actually was?  Would it have been better to ignore the situation and keep adding connections to it until it went dry?  The fact Mr. Schartz was outside the district boundary certainly did not stop Directors Ross and Skoien from advocating that another OMIDPOU parcel be connected to the system. ]

VP Richardson: Not necessarily

Director Ross: Well, then set up, you come up with a policy because that’s all we do.

VP Richardson: Well it would be nice if we did have policies but first we have to do the research to see exactly what’s been done in the past.

Director Ross: Well, its, its people have been hooked up in the past.

VP Richardson: Illegally

Director Afanasiev: Right

Multiple voices

Director Ross: Illegally, legally what ever you want to call it

VP Richardson: Well, ill – illegal in the, in the regards to a license 11395 and MID made that perfectly clear.

Director Skoien: See that to me, I’ve said this several times here, and I know Lew knows where I’m going, a lot of, all these efforts with lawyers and committees, if any of us knew what the hell we were doing and how to do it, what needs to be changed is that part of the law that says we have to pump, make up that water out of our well for the simple reason like you said, we use 1/5th of what we’re allotted. We get plenty allotment to fill, feed whoever wants water and those are ratepayers and that’s what we need here are ratepayers but because of this stigma of that law, somehow we should fight to change that. That well and I think this gentleman and Dan will tell you should be just backup because it’s it’s corrosive to our system, it’s it’s crap water compared to the lake water and if you had an common sense since we’ve never come close to using our (pounding table) allotted water that well should go on emergency backup and we should be allowed to serve water until we use up 5,000 acre feet

Tom Porter: I agree


Director Skoien: and we’ll never see that in our lifetime probably.

VP Richardson: But, but we have to think

Director Skoien: 5,000 acre feet I hope we see that law changed

VP Richardson: But Mark, first of all it’s not a law it’s a license

Director Skoien: OK license, then that

VP Richardson: The second part is we have a fiduciary duty to over half this subdivision that isn’t developed yet, they have the primary right to that water because they have been paying availability fees

Director Skoien: Right

VP Richardson: for decades

Director Skoien: Right, but if we get rid of that, that license there’s plenty

VP Richardson: You don’t get rid of a water license

Director Skoien: Get the water license changed

VP Richardson: That’s what we were trying to talk with MID about

Director Skoien: We have more than enough in our allotment that handle every other lot if they should build, I mean we’re about half

VP Richardson: And you would have the Delta-Bay Area people all over us in court.

Director Ross: So you’ve talked

Director Skoien: Why is that?

Director Ross: to MID about this? What did they say?

VP Richardson: Oh they’ve been talking about this for decades Emery

Director Afanasiev: They will not allow it

Inaudible-multiple voices

VP Richardson: They will not touch it

Director Skoien: Touch what, I didn’t…?

VP Richardson: Our place of use modification for 11395

Tom Porter: You know the only place that that term is used is here.

VP Richardson: What, water license?

Tom Porter: No, place of use, you have a district and you have outside the district, El Dorado Irrigation District, ah, Brook Trails Community Services, they have a district boundary, if you’re within that boundary they serve

VP Richardson: Well

Tom Porter: And place of use I don’t know where that came from

VP Richardson: Well as you know the district boundary was changed to go around those properties that you purchased

Tom Porter: Well, no it wasn’t

VP Richardson: It went outside, see our, originally our district coincided with the water license

Tom Porter: Ah-hum

VP Richardson: Then as people said hey I’m right across the street I’ll be a good customer, hook me up, nobody really paid attention and they ran a line out. And then someone else – hey you did it for him, do it for me, so they ran another line out over there and then pretty soon we had lines going all over the place and when MID snapped us for the 11395 that’s when the Ranchito well came in, and when we said well please, please, please let us change the license to coincide with the people we’re serving, basically it was – you created the problem you deal with it.

Tom Porter: So in the meantime, (laughs) in the meantime we have 40 acres being served past my property, through my property, ah but I can’t get it?


Director Skoien: OK, but I, and I have a question about that. The meter that that guy’s pulling off of is

Unknown: Somewhere

Director Skoien: only in the district but it’s it’s your lot across Merced Falls Road?

Tom Porter: Yeah, we were going to build a house there

IGM Tynan: That’s across, yes it is across the street

Director Skoien: OK and it’s not within the service district boundary or it is?

Tom Porter: Oh it is, it is one of, one of the lots that (inaudible)

Director Skoien: and it has, it has a meter?

IGM Tynan: What they’ve done is they’ve taken..

Director Skoien: Wait I’m getting to a point, who’s paying the bill, are you, you

Tom Porter: No I’m not paying the bill, I’m

Director Skoien: OK, but the meter is

Tom Porter: There was two car loads of people came up here, ah, I saw them a week ago and they said we’re looking for something and I said what are you looking for? They said that, they have a property over here, ah, over, and they pointed in the direction of this 40 acres and my understanding is there’s a squatter that lives there now. Ah, he’s living there the owner doesn’t and they said

Inaudible unknown

Tom Porter: our Auntie, our Auntie owns that property and I said well I know where the water hookup is, the water hookup is on that lot, I showed it to him. I said that’s where it’s hooked up and then I showed him exactly where it came up through and went through my property. SO

Director Skoien: And who pays that bill?

Tom Porter: This,

Dan Siria: The lady that owns that property

Multiple voices

Tom Porter: And, and, and what they did they came up and said OK, Auntie isn’t there anymore, the squatter’s there and the bill came to 800 and some dollars and they, this all of a sudden got their attention.

IGM Tynan: Shut their water off

Director Skoien: OK, so they, OK they, they’re the ones that have the property that the meter is on

Dan Siria: No

Dan Tynan: No

President Kinsella: No

Unknown: No

Director Skoien: You have it, OK, so how did they get billed the water if the meter is in….?

IGM Tynan: Can I explain?

Director Skoien: Yeah, yeah I don’t get it…(laughing)

Multiple voices

IGM Tynan: OK, here’s Merced Falls Road, OK? We’re going this way, here’s Merced Falls Road, here’s the meter, you go over the road, go over a second road, and here’s the properties, outside place of use but the meter is inside place of use.

Director Skoien: Yeah, but how, that meter was assigned to him?

IGM Tynan: No

Unknown: No

Unknown: No

Unknown: Yes

Multiple voices/cross talk

Director Afanasiev: Then who was it assigned to?

Dan Siria: Not the meter, but the

Tom Porter: We never did start the home

Dan Siria: Right, right, the, that yoke there is his, but the other people are using it, the simple fix and that’s on the short side where the main is, would just run a new box for his property.

Multiple voices/cross talk

Director Skoien: No I’m just wondering how they pay for the water?

IGM Tynan: Well, who’s, who’s being charged again, Syndie hasn’t been here, I’ll have

Director Skoien: That’s what I’m wondering

IGM Tynan: to go see Syndie who’s , that’s what I need to find out but Syndie has been on vacation and ah, so I’m going to have to check with her, who the people are that’s paying for that meter and paying for that $800 water bill.

Director Afanasiev: Why are they paying?

IGM Tynan: Huh?

Director Afanasiev: What are they paying?

IGM Tynan: They’ve got an 800 dollar bill I assume they are

Unknown: Maybe if they don’t pay, maybe we can have that?

Director Skoien: I got no problem with you having it for all three of them.


Director Afanasiev: Yeah, but MID does probably

Tom Porter: Another thing, if you go up on Merced Falls Road just north of Ranchito, and look to the east, you’ll see a meter that goes to Doscher. He’s outside of the district, outside of the district outside of the place of use.

Director Ross: 35 of them Tom.


President Kinsella: On the north side?

Tom Porter: No, he’s on the east side of Merced Falls Road.

President Kinsella: Ah, you go north on Merced Falls Road

Tom Porter: Yeah

President Kinsella: he’s on the east side

Tom Porter: he’s on the east, about I’d say a thousand feet up there

Dan Siria: There’s a lot of them like that, I mean when this place was done it was on the simple thing and ah

VP Richardson: right

Dan Siria: and where a

Multiple voices

Dan Siria: Craig Lawson lives, there’s one, two, three, three houses in there it’s the same thing, they’re getting their water off from Chicharra.

VP Richardson: Right. Things weren’t done properly a long time ago and it’s coming home to roost now.

Director Skoien: And there’s no way to determine who did them

Tom Porter: Well I know what I was told

Director Skoien: A lot of things happened in this office

Tom Porter: (inaudible) important to you

President Kinsella: Well let’s, I guess the simplest thing to do would be to confirm what Mr. Porter says, check our records, and then we’ll have to meld again, get together again, and see just exactly what to do along with the license

IGM Tynan: We’re still kind of messed up with the MID Outside Place of Use, inside place of use, I mean, I don’t, I can’t go against that contract but that’s why I brought it to the board because, you know, it is what it is with MID unless we can get them to (inaudible)

Director Ross: Is there any law or rule or anything that says we can’t put another well in?

Unknown: No, I don’t think so

Director Afanasiev: But where are you going to put it?

Multiple voices/cross talk

VP Richardson: And, and who’s going to pay for it?

Multiple voices

Tom Porter: And you do have another well

Director Ross: The district

VP Richardson: Why should the district pay for water to go outside the water license?

Director Ross: Because they’re gonna make money and you’re in the business of trying to pay your bills.

VP Richardson: Well then wouldn’t that be incumbent upon the people receiving the benefit to pay the charges for that well?

Director Ross: Normally the district doesn’t work that way.

VP Richardson: Well normally the district almost went bankrupt.

Director Ross: Well it did because of a publication, a newsletter, but that’s not here or there

VP Richardson: A what?

Director Ross: A newsletter did that, but anyway

VP Richardson: A newsletter?

Director Ross: A fruitless newsletter, which is (inaudible)


Tom Porter: I have another thought here

President Kinsella: OK

Tom Porter: Ah

Director Skoien: Put a well on this property

President Kinsella: Ah Mr. Porter has the floor

Tom Porter: Number one, ehh and I know what you’re going to say the Board has to make all decisions, but a board member, Wes Snyder and Bob Kent both said, yes, we will serve that property (banging on podium) to me, personally. Now you’re going to say, well one of those people is in Heaven and the other one I guess still got a lawsuit.


President Kinsella: He’s waiting

Tom Porter: So, but anyway there’s a, one more thought, I have a very good well ah, if you look on the map and it says Deerwood lots, about where it’s

Director Ross: Which map Tom? Which map?

Tom Porter: This map right here, (inaudible)

Director Ross: This one

Tom Porter: You can look to the west of that, I have a, a very good well, and I’m wondering if we could ah, rather than get legal and run off through all that stuff, if we could have, make some agreement between me and the water district to use water from there?

VP Richardson: This map?

Tom Porter: Yeah, I’ll show it to you

Director Skoien: The well is on lot 46?

Director Ross: Which lot number?

Tom Porter: It is right there

Director Skoien: Oh just the outside

VP Richardson: Oh it’s a, OK

Director Skoien: It’s behind your offices

Tom Porter: Yeah, and it’s a very good well.

Director Ross: How many gallons a minute?

Tom Porter: Three or four times as good as your well

Director Ross: How many gallons a minute?

VP Richardson: Well then why don’t you just use that for your properties?

Director Ross: Where’s it at?

Director Skoien: He says it’s somewhere in here

Tom Porter: That’s not (laughs) ah

Director Skoien: Behind his offices

Tom Porter: in other words,

VP Richardson: I mean, it’s on your property

Tom Porter: No, it’s on that property, it’s not on the other properties

VP Richardson: No, no, no, no You just said you had a very good producing well, you indicated that it’s right here

Tom Porter: Yes

VP Richardson: and that’s your property where your sales office is right?

Tom Porter: Yeah

VP Richardson: Well then, why don’t you just use your own well water?

Tom Porter: And go into the PUC business?

VP Richardson: No, like anybody else that has a well, you

Tom Porter: Well it’s not, that’s not the same property those are four different properties, in other words, the minute I

Director Skoien: In other words he may sell them and then he would be responsible

Tom Porter: if I sell them to somebody

Multiple voices

VP Richardson: Well, no

Tom Porter: I can’t serve them water, you can, I can’t.

President Kinsella: Well, he’s right

Director Skoien: Can’t provide water to

Tom Porter: I can’t (inaudible)

Multiple voices

President Kinsella: It’s his well, it’s his well

Tom Porter: (inaudible) gave it to a

VP Richardson: It’s his well, if they’re his other properties

Multiple voices

Director Skoien: Yeah, but what if, what if he wants to have water to these to sell them then they’re not

VP Richardson: Oh so then the whole point of this is to get water to sell property?

Director Skoien: Well I’m not sure, but he has a right to sell them whenever, but he can’t provide water that

VP Richardson: Yeah but see, that’s another thing about our water rights, it’s for residential domestic consumption, it’s not for speculative land development

Director Skoien: Well how do you know, some residents

Tom Porter: (inaudible)

Director Skoien: aren’t going to build on these lots if

Tom Porter: somebody buys these things

Director Skoien: I mean, (inaudible-multiple voices/cross talk)

VP Richardson: If, if, if there’s a lot of ifs.

Director Skoien: Yeah, exactly. People could be living there five years from now, we don’t know

Tom Porter: Yeah, or two years, or one year.

President Kinsella: Dan this is an operational problem, how about ah, calling the Operational Committee together

IGM Tynan: OK, yeah

President Kinsella: and ah, iron out some of the issues here and then get back with Mr. Porter and ah, the board and we’ll all sit down together again, is that alright with you sir?

Tom Porter: Who is this operational committee?

Director Skoien: Me, Dan

Tom Porter: The two of you?

Director Skoien: And well, it’s always with the President

President Kinsella: Yeah

Tom Porter: The president too huh? OK, alright, I’ve got a shot

President Kinsella: I’m the titular head of it

Tom Porter: Well, I’ve got a shot

Dan Siria: The only way that you could get credit for your well is if it’s tied right back into the raw water line that runs down that same street

Tom Porter: Well, there’s a raw water line that comes up ah

Director Ross: Yeah

Tom Porter: Barrett Cove Road

Dan Siria: Right

Tom Porter: We know that and we could take some water over there if they needed it, really it’s not a need, you don’t need the water out of this well on Ranchito, ah, it’s, it’s, it’s

Director Skoien: It meets the license and requirements

Tom Porter: It, it, it’s to satisfy your requirements

VP Richardson: To keep us legal

President Kinsella: Yeah

VP Richardson: because, see MID could get slapped with a 25 to 50 thousand dollar fine if we screw up, because we operate underneath their license and they’re not real happy about some of the things we’ve done in the past because they have the liability for it with the State Water Board.

Tom Porter: Well, wha, OK Lew, you’re part of the board, what do you think of this idea of taking some water that I would offer?


VP Richardson: I, I don’t know, I’d say if you have a good well, I think you should use your water.

Tom Porter: Well, I can’t sell to other people

VP Richardson: Well you’re asking us to

Tom Porter: you can

VP Richardson: change things with the State Water Board, I think you’d have a better chance of changing things to use your own water

Tom Porter: Well, get into the, I guess you have your other meeting

President Kinsella: Getting into, into the finer points of law

Tom Porter: then we find out that we have to go find out legally what is the status of the district and, and place of use and all those things.

President Kinsella: OK

Tom Porter: Yes sir?

Director Skoien: OK, but back to Torre then, you’re OK with those?

IGM Tynan: Yeah, Torre ah

Tom Porter: That’s finished

IGM Tynan: yeah,

Tom Porter: The only thing I would like to do is go with you when we decide where to put the laterals, there is a fire hydrant right to the corner of one of those pieces

IGM Tynan: (inaudible) mention this to Porter, I’ll get a copy, I’ll give you a copy of the MID contract and that way you’ll get more of an idea of the place of use

Multiple voices/cross talk

VP Richardson: We’re not agreeing to anything right now on these right?

President Kinsella: No

Director Skoien: It’s Operations

President Kinsella: I think that a, the Operations Committee should delve into this thing and gather all of the information possible and sit down with Mr. Porter and pick his brain for things as well as ours and present the package to the board.

IGM Tynan: It’s easier if the four of us get together and I can show you what I’m seeing on the inside outside place of use instead of just, you know, it’s hard to see if you’re

Tom Porter: And I don’t think it would hurt if this little committee actually went there and we show you exactly on the ground what it is

President Kinsella: Well that’s why I wanted, I want them to get together with you and your representative

Tom Porter: what has happened

Director Skoien: Yeah I got no problem with that (inaudible)

President Kinsella: So will you ah notify Mr. Porter when you guys want to meet and ah, his availability and then we’ll go from there.

IGM Tynan: Yeah I’ll get with you

Director Ross: Is this a Standing Committee?

President Kinsella: Agreeable Sir?

Tom Porter: Yeah, you bet.

Director Ross: Is this a Standing Committee?

President Kinsella: Yes it is

Director Ross: Then it’ll have an agenda and all that too in time?

Background voices inaudible

Tom Porter: I have more

Multiple voices/cross talk

Director Ross: If the public wants to attend

Director Skoien: Oh yeah, yeah cuz it would be a continuing subject

President Kinsella: Are we finished with this section of it?

Tom Porter: Yeah we are, we know that you’re going to provide laterals for those two pieces D and E, OK, we know that

Multiple voices in background

Tom Porter: now we’ll work out the details of where they go

President Kinsella: Right

Tom Porter: (inaudible) to his satisfaction

President Kinsella: OK

Tom Porter: OK

IGM Tynan: I’ll get with the engineer also

Tom Porter: OK, I, I guess the next thing

Multiple voices/cross talk/inaudible

Tom Porter: ….that ah

IGM Tynan: I don’t want to do the same thing..

President Kinsella: Order, Mr. Porter has the floor.

xxxxx  to be continued  xxxxx

My best to you and yours, Lew

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